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Turbulence in Tulsa as ousted Tails and Tornadoes president starts new convention in same hotel

Edited by dronon, GreenReaper as of Wed 15 Sep 2021 - 06:37
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Free Fur All convention logoIn Tulsa, Oklahoma, Tails and Tornadoes is a young convention that's been running in the Central U.S. state since 2019. Its premiere year was reviewed here on Flayrah by one-time contributor Koori Kitty. Like the weather system it was named after, the con has subsequently found itself in a whirlwind that's rattled its organization.

The first shakeup was one that affected most gatherings, in that its second year was unable to be held in 2020 due to COVID-19 closures. But on top of this, the same year brought in political fallout from the final year of Trump's presidency. Riots in the American Midwest soon spurred worldwide protests following the murder of George Floyd by a law enforcement officer, where the unarmed black man was strangled by a knee to his neck that was held there for over eight minutes. The entire duration of the strangulation was recorded on a smartphone and shared over the Internet.

The United States government, under the leadership it held, decided to go against the advisability of de-escalation in these matters and instead responded with hostile rhetoric. Given the shutdown of many non-essential jobs due to the pandemic, this created a perfect storm of vocal protests and rioting towards an unsympathetic system, sentiments that spread far beyond the Midwest where the murder took place.

Update: Correction made about staffing shifts from 2020 to 2021 in Tails and Tornados per Koori.

Update: AWOO has released a statement in their Telegram group that the hotel has withdrawn from their contract.

Getting caught up in the vortex

Problematic statements against Black folk would unfortunately be believed and echoed by some furry fans in leadership positions. One of those vocalizing these viewpoints was PeaceWolf, the head of Tails and Tornadoes' organization at the time.

Not true to her namesake, she ended up using rhetoric that called for increased violence against protesters. One of her liked posts on Twitter included a reworked Gadsden Flag (also known as the 'No steppie snake' flag by some in the fandom) which had the teeth of the snake sinking into a fist, a symbol of the protests at the time, with the words "You Were Warned".

As more issues came up, including one of PeaceWolf's previous friends coming forward with a story about how the head of the convention was perversely dismissive of a report she'd made about being groped, more pressure fell on Tails and Tornadoes to take action. After serving one year as its head, Peacewolf was replaced by Ace Shepherd in 2020, which was then handed off to Matthew for the return of the convention, held this September 2021. (Perhaps Koori, their Hotel Liaison and Volunteer Coordinator [Correction, they are now the Vice President], will do another write-up of the 2021 event for Flayrah, if they haven't forgotten about us during the long hiatus! [He has! Thanks!])

Tulsa Two-Step

The taste of leading a community can lead some folks to do things that may seem fanatical. However, that's the essence of what the meaning of fandom is. Instead of taking the time to reflect upon her actions before climbing back upon the horse, a healthy thing that all of us have to do from time to time, Peacewolf instead decided to get back on the bronco and start her own rodeo.

Instead of starting another convention or furmeet in another part of the state, she decided to attempt to start a new convention called Free Fur All ("America's Anthro Convention") held at the very same hotel as Tails and Tornadoes, though not on the same dates. She would back this using her newly-founded organization named AWOO. Which stands for Anthro West Open Organization - or Anthro Western Open Organization - It depends if you're looking at the banner or the logo on their 'About' page.

It's easy to tell that the acronym of the organization came first, with the actual name being merely an afterthought.

Speaking of "What's in a name", while their acronym-loving idea might have been internally appreciated as being clever, it may not have been a strong marketing move. "Awoo" is a pretty common onomatopeia that's popular outside furry fandom, and "Free Fur All" is also apparently the name of a game made for the We Bare Bears series. So on search engines, We Bare Bears will be obscuring the furry convention. Isn't it ironic, don't you think, that a furry convention named itself in such a way that it ended up obstructed by furry media?

Not only that, the Anthropomorphic Writer's Outreach Organization took the AWOO acronym in the fandom first. Due to this situation, they had to make a distancing statement after PeaceWolf's organization made their Free Fur All announcement. It should be noted that because it's a writer's organization, the words used to spell out the acronym's letters actually make cohesive sense.

Still, even though the two conventions are scheduled during opposite points of the year, if Free Fur All actually comes to fruition, then the fact that they're being held in the same facility will shatter any previous records of furry con proximity. It's too bad these sister conventions are more of a literal Cinderella story, than just a figurative one.

A Cantina of the self-described "Cancelled"

Free Fur All has made itself out to be a welcoming community for a rogues gallery of fursona-non-gratas who have developed over years of furry participation on social media. Its first year, scheduled for 2022, includes 2 the Ranting Gryphon as an honored guest, a self-proclaimed comedian whose participation in early furry fandom likely helped push his career for hyuks further than it probably would have gotten otherwise.

The convention's own website acknowledges the social controversies surrounding their brand of entertainment:

"Unfortunately, in 2016, his excursion in comedy was considered 'canceled' after being accused of being a 'Homophobic, Transphobic, Misogynist, Racist, Nazi' for the usual sin of publicly declaring a belief and passion for the concept of free speech."

All that may be true, but I think some furs see him as villainous because he literally looks like if Judge Doom from Who Framed Roger Rabbit and Dr. Eggman from Sonic the Hedgehog had a baby.

2 also tried to run a convention in Southern California called Antheria, which only lasted two years. To be fair, it's not clear if this is because the gryphon's leadership style didn't work out, or if it was because the name they gave it sounded like a disease that would cause unstable bowel movements, so furries stayed away. There was no official statement on why it dissolved, so no one can say for certain.

This is why Peacewolf's convention has been calling itself a return to the "OG" fandom. It's led and guested by those who have found themselves left behind, through their own actions of punching toward the downtrodden, or from not taking steps to improve themselves or their fan community. The fandom, meanwhile, has continued to grow, discover, follow and enjoy new leaders and comedians. It has yet to be seen if the convention will actually have panels covering historical aspects of the fandom, or if it will perpetuate a myth of a once consequence-free fandom that never really existed for most of us.

It's the reason that many in the fandom have noted that the newly-announced convention is more than likely to become a wretched hive of scum and villainy, and to use caution.

I Tread on Thee

The fact that Peacewolf's new convention is to be held in the very same place as her old one suggests a motivation of revenge. Announcing her con the week before Tails and Tornadoes 2021 could be seen as coincidental, but it's certainly the best time to cause the greatest disruption to the proceedings of her old con. Non-local furry fans might even call the hotel to express their concerns about its furry con - not realizing there was another furry con already happening there. Distinguishing between the two would be essential to ensure that fans wouldn't unwittingly harm the reputation of Tails and Tornadoes.

Another source that points toward a desire for vengeance comes from an article written by Allie Capps, a previous President of the Furry Writers' Guild, citing an anonymous source that said that AWOO attempted (and failed) to get an exclusivity agreement with the hotel for holding furry gatherings:

"It has been confirmed to us by an anonymous source that [PeaceWolf] is the creative force behind the convention as well as by incorporation documents for Awoo Association. It was also revealed to us by the same source that Awoo Association allegedly attempted to get the hotel to sign an exclusivity clause which would have forced Tails and Tornadoes Fur Con to find a new host for their event, but the hotel refused to do so."

Tails caught in the Tornado

While those such as Allie Capps have expressed the desire to try to shut down Free Fur All, it's important to remember that they may not be successful. Hotels are in the business of trying to book as many gatherings as they can, to make up for lost revenues during the pandemic. It's why the Marriott is more than happy to have both events.

However, while they may want to avoid direct confrontation towards their ousted leader, Tails and Tornadoes are going to need to take preventative measures and gather fandom support to protect against further competitive wrath. The best way to take on Free Fur All may be to not deal with it in any manner that would give it more attention. Instead, perhaps the strategy would be to kill it with kindness toward Tails and Tornadoes.

Their hotel liaison should do what they can to make it clear to the management that Tails and Tornadoes is not represented by the actions of Free Fur All, despite being from the same hobby. Try to make it clear their convention is being led by problematic staff that was once on the board of Tails and Tornadoes.

It's very possible that the new convention, should they start to see a failure in the numbers they hope to reach in their first year, may aim to damage the hotel's attitude towards furry fandom on their way out. A sort of take-you-down-with-me approach; it wouldn't be too unexpected of someone who has a reputation for spitefulness. So building up excellent hotel relations is very essential to protect Tails and Tornadoes from any fallout that results from any pending free-for-all.

One of the best ways to segregate Tails and Tornadoes from Free Fur All would be to sever ties with their shared charity of Safari's Sanctuary, which PeaceWolf volunteers with, and to instead pick another local charity in 2022.

For the rest of those furry fans who would like to take action, this is the perfect opportunity for our fandom to make Tails and Tornadoes a stable and popular convention going into the post-pandemic era. You'd want to ensure that we treat the hotel staff like kings, and bring unbridled joy to them. This is especially important as the other convention, more aligned towards those with narcissistic tendencies, will likely look upon the staff as tools and treat them as such.

The more that Tails and Tornadoes flourishes without its "OG" leader, and the more her Free Fur All venture remains static in growth, the more she may have to confront the grave errors she made: in seeking vengeance, and in becoming controlled by the anger that social media can encourage.

If, however, you are someone that does decide to go to Free Fur All instead, remember this important fact. The convention is not political. Sure, it may be led by a person who was ousted from their position of power at the other convention held in the same hotel, but that's not political at all.

More seriously though, just treat everyone well, the way you would want to be treated in return. If you do that and you're successful then perhaps you'll have the rest of us eating our words. Prove us wrong.


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Setting aside the whole "we're scheduling a new convention in the exact same place as another convention" because "I SHALL BE AVENGED!" (always a good reason to do ... anything, really), as an Oklahoman, I think maybe also you should try and avoid the Rocklahoma rock festival a bit better, especially if you're in Tulsa because it's kind of right there. I mean, Tornadoes and Tails happened to have the exact same dates as Rocklahoma this year, but only because the festival was postponed a bit (for, you know, reasons), but under normal circumstances, that wouldn't happen. Free Fur All, however, put their's right in their normal time period.

I mean, obviously catering to slightly different crowds, but there's got to be some overlap; also, Tulsa's got to be at least a little bit busier than normal. I'm not sure about those dates.

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Curiously, 'Free Fur All' is also a popular furry Discord guild (reviews), and... a furry RP board where "you can be your own mate"? (I like Sky's use of "Battle Against a True Hero" from Undertale. Does she count as furry, or feathery? Who can tell, poptropica30319.)

And let's not forget fursuit makers Fun Fur All and One Fur All. There are only so many names.

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What a foofaraw!

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Free Fur All's promo video is already at 500+ comments.

May the best con win? Nothing like free-market competition, and it may give furs from further afield reason to visit.

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I'm surprised they kept comments open. I guess they know that engagement increases sharing? Where as comments on Twitter usually don't and lead to people saying things like 'ratio'd', so best just to deactivate and let people quote retweet.

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It's funny, because the guy saying that was ratio'd right to the bottom of the comments... overall they seem a good mix.

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Hey everyone! No, I didn't forget about you guys regarding the TTFC 2021 article. I'm trying to get caught up this week (RIP)

One small change to this article -- Ace actually took the chair for a short period of time in 2019 before Mattew became our new permanent chair. I now serve as the President (of the parent organization) and Vice-Chair of the event itself. Along with that, we wear multiple hats (WHEW).

For those wondering, TTFC has absolutely no affiliation with the aforementioned organization. We are happy to be a positive part of the community, all things considered, and look forward to many great years to come!


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Thanks for the comment, sorry for the outdated information. Have to start realizing the configurations on Wikifur could be a bit outdated.

Thanks for your hard work this year. Having attendance growth out there in spite of the one year hiatus is a good sign.

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It's always good to double-check facts. To a large extent, WikiFur relies on updates from interested parties - and let's be honest, most con staff have had more important things to do recently. But anyone can edit to help out!

It seems someone was interested in FFA, as not only does it have an article, it got added to the furry convention map (albeit with a broken image and without the 18+ age restriction - now fixed). Of course, adding an entry is easier than keeping it up to date - and since it is in the same place, and we sort the largest cons on top, it's not so easy to click...

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Okay, I also doubt "FFA" sticks as an acronym; Oklahoma's a state where even the furries would think "Future Farmers of America" reflexively.

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... I hadn't heard that acronym since high school man.

I miss pancake breakfasts...

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I personally hope that Safari's severs all ties with Peacewolf and her organization, and refuse any donations that they try to give.

We don't want charity from people who want us to not exist.

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The convention is not political. Sure, it may be led by a person who was ousted from their position of power at the other convention held in the same hotel, but that's not political at all.

Let's be real. It's purely political. It's all about revenge and giving a safe space for nazifur snowflakes.

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Regardless of my personal feelings on any of the players involved, I'm giving this article a D grade. Please learn the difference between reporting and an editorial, and don't try to combine them in one work. And low blows are low blows. Seriously, we're down to the level of making fun of people for how they LOOK? In FURRY FANDOM? Please.

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I never meant to imply Eggman or Doom looked *bad*. More that they are usually seen as the baddies in furry media.

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As a onetime journalist, I would agree that putting a "Perspective" tag on the article or in the headline is good practice. I believe the difference between a that and an editorial is that editorials are consensus positions of the editorial board.

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We don't do editorials in that sense, in part because we have too few editors and coordination between them for it to be feasible, but also because Flayrah is meant to be a form of citizen journalism, covering a wide range of viewpoints.

Instead, work is tagged as 'opinion' - which translates to Google News' op-ed tag, unless also tagged 'review' or 'interview' - and we copyedit and publish multiple opinions from both regular and occasional submitters. Newsletters are also a form of opinion, I guess, but treated as press releases for syndication purposes.

That means this piece is Sonious' opinion, not Flayrah's - which as a news platform, doesn't have an opinion. dronon edited it, but for opinion that typically means copyediting and polishing to clearly express the author's intent. (Sometimes, it's a lot of polishing.)

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Hmmmm then maybe next time for opinion articles, putting "Opinion: ..." in front of the title would allow people to instantly know if its a opinion piece, cuz graphic design wise putting a opinion tag only at the bottom of the page would really decrease its visibility,

and that could explain why people were so furious about this article looking like a editorial-reporting merger rather than a opinion piece as you've intended to show it as.

For example you can use, "Opinion: Political war breaks furry fandom on par with polarization in the USA". Compare that with not putting the word "Opinion" up front.

The importance of distinguishing opinion pieces from actual reports straight at first sight is critical to ensuring people aren't misled unintentionally.

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Technically, popular tags like 'opinion' that match the story are also highlighted in the tag bar shortcuts up top, though I appreciate that effect is subtle and not as visible on all screens (and the impact is reduced due to the "featured" block now in-between it and the title).

The "Opinion:" option is suggested in the titles section of the contribution guidelines, which also has advice on opinion - much of it learnt through experience over the years. Of course, they are just guidelines… but worth considering.

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Article is properly tagged as 'opinion'. Sonious couldn't write a non-opinionated article if his life depended on it. If you don't like his sensationalist journalism I suggest you just stop reading his work, cuz he ain't gonna change his approach for anyone.

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BS and Twitter walks. It feels good to roast bad apples, but it doesn't mean anyone else is listening.

Yelling at/about this con may do nothing to stop them and may help them.
- The hotel cares about booking rooms, not fruitless rage from nonattendees
- Con may have an arrangement with the hotel, but that may not be complete until they actually book rooms
- Booking may need lots of attention, so beware Streisand Effect of yelling about the con
- "Crying wolf" now may hurt communicating later, like sharing records of secret staff

Speaking of records, here's 2 Gryphon helping to platform an inarguable hate group

Same source platformed in 2018; that's years of pretending not to know about open (white) "nationalism" by an inarguable neo-nazi

A clue to another open neo-nazi involved

Better than yelling is gathering info for a stronger case when it's not premature. And yes, polite communication with hotel staff.

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Claim of con's demise

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As a notable Wolf once said, let's not start sucking each other's dicks just yet.

Running a con was never the only goal, here; hell, it probably wasn't the primary goal. If starting up a successful con, or even a niche-but-ongoing "apolitical" (not enough scare quotes in the world, is there?) alternative was the primary goal, then it would be held basically anywhere but a city that already has a convention. Nah, this is about revenge; I'm not celebrating until Tails and Tornadoes still exists.

I don't think we're dealing with evil geniuses, but we are arguably dealing with evil. This con kind of sounds like a suicide play; taking out T'n'T (now there's an abbreviation that needs to catch on!) was the endgame. If Free For All became an actual thing, well, gravy, but this is has "Ricardo Montalban quoting Moby Dick at the end of The Wrath of Khan" vibes written all over it (uh, "Khan/con" pun not originally intended, but yeah, let's go with it). Hell, a lot of that crowd still blames Deo for sabotaging Denver's con; "you took our con, we take one of yours."

With that in mind, calling up a bunch of hotels and telling them "you don't want to host this furry convention, it's bad business" is probably not actually helpful for Tails and Tornadoes' short-term health. They've had two conventions; not really a lot of time to really start a relationship, or even give the hotels time distinguish the "good" con from the "bad" con. At this point, from a business standpoint, it's easier to just say, "You know what, fuck this shit, no furries." instead of making the distinction.

Besides, it's fucking Tulsa; a Trump rally widely reported as having a disappointing turn out last year in Tulsa easily had double the attendance of Tails and Tornadoes this year. You're kind of making an odd assumption about Oklahoma (a.k.a. possibly the solidest red state in America).

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I must note that Antheria, the unsuccessful convention headed by 2 Gryphon in Southern California, was located within a half hour of Califur's operations.

We all remember what happened to Califur, yeah?

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Actually I didn't, but, yeah, this.

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In the interest of differentiating the cons, and for letting prospective attendees know exactly what they're in for, I suggest rebranding Free Fur All as RepubliCon. Maybe DonnieConnie would also work.

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Leaning into it instead of trying to pretend they are something they are not would probably be preferable for them and their attendees.

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Its sad to see someone fall down a hole, but my god is it fascinating when they start digging. This wolf woman dug so deep she started finding bigoted mole people underground and enlisting them to help her dig EVEN DEEPER.

This metaphor got away from me but in any case I just hope this whole debacle reaches a disappointing anticlimax where attendees are either too few or two destructive to be economically viable and the hotel doesn't invite them back.

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I'm in favour of opinion pieces and letting author's have a known bias but wow... this was not great. A lot of weird low-blows and a lot of unnecessary speculation (Didn't you read a journalistic ethics book after speculating on people's motivations last year?). There's a difference between having a position and just attacking people's character. I really would've expected better.

As it is, this whole thing is unnecessary and pointless drama. Perhaps the existence of the convention itself is pointless drama too, I will not pretend to know the motivations of those that started it, but the bigger question is "so what?" So many people seem to be so upset that some people with whom they disagree are having their own convention. Let me them have their convention. If you don't like it, don't go to it. But there's no reason to stop them having it.

"If all mankind minus one, were of one opinion, and only one person were of the contrary opinion, mankind would be no more justified in silencing that one person, than he, if he had the power, would be justified in silencing mankind."
~John Stuart Mill~

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I had, but then I read your article on free speech you linked again and decided that it was probably the direction to go than some silly old morale book.

In honesty, though, the 2 Gryphon section probably could have gotten left out, it was the only section that really had the low blows and in honesty didn't add much to the story. But I guess that's comedy right? Find the line and cross it deliberately?

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Mentioning 2 as a guest is valid. Guests can indicate the tone of an event, or at least those the organizers consider worthy of praise or likely to attract a desired audience.

The issue was combining that with trash talk which, judging by the reception, was not fully appreciated by our audience - many of which likely recall a time when social media was not the gold standard of approval. It also means you end up relying on your own opinion. If you truly "think some furs see him as villainous", it'd be more powerful to quote and link references to them expressing that view, and let readers judge for themselves. (And if you don't believe that... don't say it? It's "opinion", not "jokes".)

Reading through, it'd probably have worked better as a video script, where tone is more obvious, than it did in a news story. Which is unfortunate, because it undermines potentially relevant stuff mentioned in that section, like the failure of Antheria.

I've generally found it works better to write a straight article and save opinion and comedy for the comments - or a separate piece. If nothing else, it makes it shorter, and so more likely to be read. We also didn't already have a straight news piece about the new con, so it would have been beneficial. Of course, it also has to be something contributors want to write.

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Thank you, Green. You directly addressed the concern that I (and I think Rakuen too) had expressed.

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I would like to say I don't feel kind of sub-tweeted by proxy by GR's comment, because, I mean, even though my latest article literally starts with a long set up before reaching a punchline, or, put another way, a joke, and that's hardly an isolated incident. It was literally a review, or more particularly, not news. I do also frequently put jokes in my "news", but I don't really do a lot of actual "fandom" news. It's more "here's something in pop culture furries might like", or entertainment news, and, well, it's entertainment, so I feel a bit more lee-way is allowed that sort of thing.

Sonious, I don't want to say this, but you do have an "editorializing" problem. You like to break news on the opinion page, and you kind of shouldn't do that. I mean, this is my version of the Oklahoma furry convention dies horrible, embarrassing death; as the comments make clear, I had opinions about that convention, but I kept them to Reddit instead of the article. Ummm, that still didn't work because PATCH PACKRAT IS A FUCKING ASSHOLE, but you know, if you just read the article, everything was fine. I also did speculate about what else was maybe going on; but once again, I kept that to the comments.

Look at the comment below this. This fucking shitweasel almost has a point (and yes I googled him and read like half a page of tweets, yes, "fucking shitweasel" constitutes accurate reporting here). And this keeps happening. Mike Retriever/Ben Dover was able to get both Rakuen and Green Reaper on your case (which, to be fair, is not that hard) about non-white visibility in the fandom because you couldn't keep from editorializing instead of just saying "there's a hashtag furries of color are using." Yes, it was a purely political story; I mean, not just the way you wrote it, but the entire subject matter. And that context needed to be brought up, but there's a difference between noting that context and drowning out the actual story with the context (and your own take on that context).

But, I think Green Reaper may have made a pretty pertinent observation; you're a YouTuber. That's what you do. That's a different medium. It has different rules. And, to be clear, I'm not being snobby. I'm saying you should probably just post videos. Isiah Jacob did reviews that way. I don't know if that's already been shot down by Green Reaper or dronon or you yourself or whatever, but it might be worth a shot. All you need is a short lead in paragraph, and you're golden.

It would also cut down on another, uh, well, problem I'd like to point out. Good god, your articles are way too long. I worry about bloat in my reviews (and, aside to GR, that's why I don't add subheads any more to my reviews, even though you added them a lot of times; I don't know why, but they cause my word count to balloon, and, holy shit, I need all the help I can get, so don't take that personally), but I'm luckily not too afraid to just chop shit (I mean, obviously not in my comments, but that's different, probably). OMIT NEEDLESS WORDS. KILL YOUR BABIES.

Okay, I think I'm done. Just remember, we're all amateurs here. We're all learning. Don't take any of this personally, partially because it's not meant to be hurtful, partially because I'm a giant gaping asshole that no one should pay any attention to. Just remember, let's have fun. Okay, break!

Oh, uh, aside to Mink; sorry. Not really a reply to you. You can safely ignore this if you choose to.

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Thanks, I'll definitely consider changing styles from here on in. After I get through this next wave of stress that'll be coming our way.

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Well, do take care of yourself; whatever else, I definitely want you still around. So thanks for taking it well (I really am uncomfortable about the comment); I really doubt I'd take a similar out of the blue critique as well. And the most important advice is truly "have fun".

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(1) His 2015 article about Oklacon is unsourced with a factually incorrect attack: "they had no real relationship with any local community. WikiFur lists Watonga, Oklahoma as the con's home town, but I doubt most Watongans are aware that the con existed." (... he doesn't go to the con...)

(2) Says he "kept them to Reddit instead of the article" but the link shows FALSE. And then he did it again on Reddit and brought up personal grudges at the con himself on my 2015 article that was SOURCED about a relationship with the community. (Local congoer: "…The real victim, ultimately, is Watonga. The chamber of commerce there called it “bigger than Christmas”, amounting to 11% of that town’s annual economy." -- same source also gives him sympathy about his problem.)

(3) After he starts, multiple independent readers point out his grudge bias. (... calls it "shitty con"... doesn't go to con...)

"DUDE! Dafuq?!? Oh yeah, you just established YOUR "journalistic ethics" right there. ... I'll read anything with your name on it with this in mind from now on."

"I don't think you had any reason to write the article with a biased standpoint. From a purely journalistic standpoint, it's unethical."

(4) He picked the fight on Reddit, goes on to attack being too nice to the con and asking to get the facts straight, with hostility to doing research or making calls. Then he admits being "aggressive and angry." SIX months later he brings it up out of the blue on unrelated review of movie he didn't watch to pick a fight again. Then he flips his shit and flounces out as editor because of inability to stop grudging about his mistakes.

APOLOGY TIME! LOL, don't wait for it from the broken record. Just leaving this here to paste from the same old file every time. :)

Sonious' article is a lovely work of perfection by comparison.

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So, uh, you gonna update your website sometime this month?

You could run a story about this. It would be about as current as your front page.

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And for the record, I sent Patch a private message to try and, well, apologize; it was on Flayrah's message system, and that's always been a bit spotty, but I'm pretty sure we were communicating with it beforehand. Furthermore, my final post on that Reddit piece read, in it's entirety (some italics added):

Patch, there hasn't been another comment or even upvote or downvote for the last day.

It's just us shouting at each other, except now it's just you shouting at me. You're also kind of rambling. Seriously, are you okay? Is there something else I need to apologize for? Are you mad at me for anything else; do we need to talk about it?

You're actually scaring me here.

Seeing as how Patch would go on to harass me out of the editorial position here at Flayrah, I was not scared enough. I mean, read the thread he's linked to; I keep calling him a friend until the very end. I still don't know why he was that angry about Oklacon. Nobody actually gets that angry about, well, "ethics in hobbyist journalism", no matter what Gamergaters tell you. At the very least, the fact that I'm still here and nobody else has said anything about the Oklacon article and how "unprofessional" it is to me at any point kind tells me, at the end of the day, I mean, it's not that big a deal. So one random otter in the Reddit thread and Patch, ... and honestly nobody else cares about the fact I wrote an article about a con I didn't like. And you know what, I don't either.

And you know who else I don't think cares? Patch. It's what he's very viciously, and somewhat effectively attacked me for, but at the end of the day, I don't think this is what's it about. I might have embarrassed him by basically calling out his "call up and annoy mid-level bureaucrats who have no idea what the fuck is going on and probably limited power to actually do anything, anyway" plan as stupid, and I guess that was a bit mean, sorry about being mean (not sorry for thinking it was stupid, because, for the record, yeah, that was a fucking stupid plan). He actually invited me join him away from Flayrah at one point when Green Reaper was Inkbunny-ing it up, but I kind of just brushed it off, because I wanted stay at Flayrah, where we had a decade old archive, and a new site wouldn't have that. I never really articulated that to him, and that was rude. Probably not rude enough, either, to make him that angry.

Then I ended up finally just asking Green Reaper if he wanted to edit, and he gave me privileges. I'm theorizing here, but maybe Patch wanted them, I don't know. I remember at the time that GR basically said basically he'd considered me and Higgs Raccoon (and that guy kind ghosted, didn't he? Bad time at Flayrah.). I'm not really sorry I got the job he wanted, if that's it? Sorry. But it's all speculation.

I just don't fucking know what I did to piss him off like that. I sure as fuck know what he did to piss me off; he harassed me with personal attacks using a personal admission someone else in the fucking reddit directly asked me about of a painful memory to the point where I literally had to leave a position in a community and pool of friends to get the fuck away from him. In that reddit, I asked you, point blank, if you were mad a me for anything else.

You still haven't answered that question.

I can't apologize until you tell me what I'm apologizing for.

Your rating: None Average: 1.3 (4 votes)


Starts with outright lie, and picking fights (again, repeatedly) isn't your place to "explain." But you already got caught out doing several falsehoods, why not throw more on the pile and double down?

Seek help

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I sent you a message. Apparently you didn't get it. That is unfortunate, but not a lie. And, actually I can back it up a little:

You can't have logged on here without getting my message; I tried.

That is from a comment in the Oklacon article (I should maybe link it, but goddammit, you already did for me).

I'm going to go point by point:

1. My "unsourced and factually incorrect attack" is, well, unsourced and factually incorrect (well, actually, I list a source, WikiFur, but I disagree with it, so whatever), but not, as you claim, part of the article. It's a comment under the article in which I am no longer speaking as a journalist, but as myself. I'm not apologizing for that, other than to agree, yeah, I was wrong. If it had been in the article, a correction would've been appropriate. But it wasn't in the article. (It also wasn't an attack; why the fuck did the con need to have a relationship with Watonga?)

2. Once again, I did call Oklacon "shitty", which is not very nice, admittedly, but once again, not in the article. That was on Reddit. I speculated (admittedly incorrectly) once again in the comments, not the article; furthermore, I didn't ever call Oklacon shitty at Flayrah, certainly not part of the article. And, even in the Reddit thread, I mean, first of all, there were less than 10 total participants, and I wasn't the only one who badmouthed the con.

3. Okay, I missed caffeinated_wolf. However, him and are Ion Otter are random dudes on Reddit while my actual editor, Green Reaper, never said shit. Noone on Flayrah's staff ever said shit. And I know multiple people via Flayrah who have also talked to you on my behalf and have told you your harassment of me was not cool. You may have won this fight with randos, but you didn't win this fight with anyone who matters.

4. Basically, true, and if there's anything to critique on the Oklacon article is that I basically just copy and pasted the convention's own announcement (which also had some errors involving alcohol/consent laws in OK, apparently, because, you know, they were a shitty con). And furthermore, I think it's obvious if I ever do get "cancelled" I'm not going to do well.

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EARTH TO ASSHOLE: Picking fights again, FIVE FUCKING YEARS TOO LATE, YOU ARE NOT THE VICTIM. Losing a fight you picked and repeatedly keep picking is not being ""harassed"".


Seek help.

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Okay, GreenReaper tells Sonious, just a few comments above:

I've generally found it works better to write a straight article and save opinion and comedy for the comments

Basically, in the Oklacon article, I did exactly what he recommends here.

But, I see you changed attack fronts. I'm not a bad person because I'm "a bad, unethical journalist", I'm a bad person who starts fights. And also holds grudges.

Okay, first. Yes. Well known. Green Reaper has, in the past, told me as much. Also told me to stop cussing so much. He hasn't recently, but I think it's mostly because he's seen that as a lost clause. I believe mwalimu once threatened to ban me (he actually denied that when I brought it up with him one time, but maybe he was just bluffing at the time). Sonious is a bit coyer about it, but, yeah, he's definitely had his "okay, crossie, let it go" moments. Equivamp has definitely called me out. So, join the club! (Oh, and if you have time, ask Chipotle about The Lord of the Rings some time; you will love it!)

And, yes, I perhaps should apologize (to a lot of people!); in fact, that might be it. I finally went too far with you, and, well, whatever it was that crossed the line, I'm genuinely sorry.

But, second, so what? I don't regret fighting with you, either in general or about Oklacon specifically. I say in the Reddit thread we disagreed. We had fights. But I enjoyed them. I though (maybe wishfully) you might have enjoyed them a bit too. What I'm saying is, yes, I can see the drawbacks to being as combative as I am on the Internet, but, really, I'm okay with it. People still apparently find me ... something, hell if I know ... enough to put up with it. If you don't want to deal with it, that is more than fair. You don't need me; why the fuck should you have to deal with this crap. You know where I'm going to be (i.e. right here); you can avoid me.

Which brings me to my final point; little fucking hypocritical, buddy. I may be a fucking little turd who gets in fights, but so do you. I mean, I can still be friends with Rakuen Growlithe; you can't! Oh, and though Green Reaper may find my keyboard exploits exasperating, there has never been a point where he made me apologize for a comment slapfight in the contents of my actual article.

Someone in this comment section has, though! Yeah, I'm gonna fucking link to that one:

The post's author, Patch Packrat, reports reacting with uncharacteristic hostility to a few critics, and apologizes to Perri Rhoades for personally attacking her in incredibly mean and unclassy ways above and beyond disagreement, due to personal stress and "triggering" that's better discussed with his therapist than on the Internet.

(And, oh my god, you had to publicly apologize to Perri Rhoades, how embarrassing for you!)

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Picks fight, non-apology "apology", attempt to pick more fights.

YOU ARE NOT THE VICTIM. Losing a fight you picked and repeatedly keep picking is not being ""harassed"".


Seek help.

Your rating: None Average: 3.7 (7 votes)

As a journalist yourself presenting yourself like this ain't professional at all

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This is probably the most appreciate time to use the "Boy that escalated quickly" meme.

You know... since it follows a scene where news-folk get into a battle to the death in an alleyway.

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We were just enjoying the fact that two article writers were fighting each other and accusing the other of various things. Makes for a good "drama" piece later on.

-Anonymous Inari

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1) Comments tend to stay in comments and aren't really 'news worthy'
2) The grudge between CrossAfflition and DogPatch is not really news here, it's been known for awhile.

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Lollllllll that works

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I don't really know who is the one most wrong or what this claws and fangs fight was about precisely, but you come across as the more unhinged and unreasonable person in general. You probably should take your own advice and seek help for your impulse and rage issues.

Your rating: None Average: 3.9 (7 votes)

Oh, and if you have time, ask Chipotle about The Lord of the Rings some time; you will love it!

Please don’t. :)

For whatever it’s worth, I (re)read the Flayrah article on Oklacon’s demise that you wrote and it’s perfectly straightforward, with no opinions or hypotheticals, quotes directly from primary sources, etc. The comment Patch linked to about “[Oklacon] had no real relationship with any local community” is a supposition that proved to be wrong, but that’s not an “attack”. (Most furry cons arguably have little real relationships with their local communities; it’s not a crazy assumption that one held seven miles outside of a tiny rural town wouldn’t have much of one.) The linked Reddit thread reveals an unpleasant personal history you had with Oklacon, but…the article just doesn’t show that coming through as bias.

— Chipotle

Your rating: None Average: 1 (1 vote)

I'm curious- why are you named after a fast food restaurant corporation and it's food item namesake?

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"Chipotle" is a smoked chile pepper. (Usually it's a smoked jalapeño, but not always.) The pepper had its name long before the burrito chain -- and Chipotle the coyote is named after the pepper. (She also predates the burrito chain's national expansion, and IIRC, I hadn't heard of the restaurant when I named her.)

— Chipotle

Your rating: None Average: 3.8 (6 votes)

Social media is a heap of manure. It helps me distinguish good journalism from bad one: the more an article makes references to social media, the more shit it is.

This heuristic I just mentioned is more adequate than having an aggregate opinion based on comments from social media.

Your rating: None Average: 2.7 (6 votes)

Free speech should not be a ticket to ignorance of news ethics though.

Though, it's good this article is labelled opinion at least. This can be considered as one perspective of the story - an increased of professionalism would be more appreciated

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Have you read any media ethics books beyond the years in which gay folks were put into mental institutions as the societal norm?

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That incident you cited is true to what happened in the past. I don't see any correlation between that and media ethics

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Oh the irony firedog, the irony is dripping right out of everything you said there.
One would have thought that earning a living would put an end to your shitposting here but it seems we're wrong once again- you surprised us.

BTW, how's the dog's g-spot doing?

Your rating: None

LOL What was that in reference to?

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Not too keen on articles where the writer spends the whole first part of it letting us know what the 'correct' way to view events is. Kinda makes me think the whole thing might be written in a slanted manner to lead us to a conclusion, rather than presenting the facts objectively.

I used to make ranty, opinionated FA journals like that, and I was an asshat while I was doing it.

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The difference now is that they fit into 280 characters, yeah?

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We can now confirm that it's Anthro West Open Organization. They have fixed the badge on the site to match the banner.

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It Saddens me to report that 2cross2affliction raped someone at oklacon and caused the con to shut down

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Well, at least you made DogPatch look professional and ethical in his above comments by comparison, so congrats!

I guess DogPatch Press is now going to be CrossAffliction's second most hated furry publication under the Furry Times for trying to take an assault he was a victim of and try to make him into the perp...

Just no words, man.

Your rating: None Average: 2.9 (7 votes)

Do you have any evidence of this? Are you the person they raped? How do you know? Just throwing out accusations without evidence is just hearsay and does nothing to help the issue.

-Anonymous Inari

Your rating: None Average: 3.4 (5 votes)

Honestly this is so bizarre that it's actually pretty funny. Ahmar as a man without much of a sense of humor, but I think this is just a tasteless joke at my expense (which, whatever, I probably deserve it; hope this didn't get you the "ban talk" from GR, though if I had to guess it's the anon tormenting Diamond Man with VPNs).

Put down the imaginary notepad, Inari; your reporter RP'ing is about as not embarrassing as your "we are legion" schtick.

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Your profile information still contains your real first and last name and home address.

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Watching furry journalists tear each other apart suddenly over matters I don't understand is simultaneously amusing, bewildering, and disheartening. The only thing I really learned from this article/page- besides the dysfunction of Flayrah's cadre- is that Dogpatch has a serious rage issue and CrossAffliction is an asshole.

I had no idea furry journalism was so self-conflicting and rancorous.

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